Investing in Humanity and Building Things that Love People with Amar Patel

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My guest today, Amar Patel, is a bit younger of a demographic than many of my guests, but that’s on purpose. Amar’s early in his career, and as he’ll tell you in this interview, he’s in his twenties and still just trying to figure out exactly where he’s going, what exactly he’s doing. He has made the decision at this moment to pursue technology.

He does product management. He’s building great things that I believe are really making humanity a better place.

I love how he thinks about the impact of what he does. I love how he thinks about his mission at this stage in his life and approaches. It is really in an iterative process that he’s figuring it out as he goes. And I think that’s such an important framework for all of us to use as we think about our careers and our lives and where we are going.

You’ll find Amar’s energy is just contagious. He is just so much fun to talk to you. So let’s go ahead and jump right on in.

Listen in here:

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Resources Mentioned:

Amar’s Website#1 & Website#2

Amar’s Instagram

Amar’s Linkedin

Software Generated Transcription:

Dan: Omar. Thank you so much for joining me. Welcome to The Meaning Movement podcast.

Amar: Oh, my gosh, man. I’m stoked to be here, Dan. This is sweet. I love, uh, just spending time with you, man. I mean, I know we haven’t spent too much time together, but uh, always a fun time, so

Dan: love it. Love it. Well, I’m, I’m stoked. Yeah. To just to dig in, uh, the question I like to start with is how do you begin to talk about the work that you do?

Amar: Uh, yeah, so I think this has been like the question that we all get asked and we go, oh, I don’t know. Um, and so, uh, I definitely thought through this one, uh, so for me, I think. You know, I’ve done a lot of hard work on figuring out, you know, more of my identity. So I’m 25 to put that, put things into perspective for people who are listener.

And, uh, you know, my name means to a Omar means to love in Spanish, in, in Arabic, it means to build Uma as like the root and then in Hindi, it means forever. And so my whole thing is like, whatever projects, whatever opportunities I take on. If it aligns with that ethos of, you know, does it, can I build things that love people forever?

Right. And it’s all unto investing in humanity. That’s kind of been like the working tagline that I’ve had for like my brand. Um, and one of the big things with that has been through my recent ventures, you know, I started a wonder and wonder, which is a independent product and design consulting agency. That’s really after mission driven organizations.

Um, and the big thing with that is we’ve just noticed that so many of these mission driven organizations sometimes don’t have. They’re underdogs. They don’t have all the resources that Silicon valley does. And so can we use some of the, you know, product thinking and the rapid prototyping to like help their ideas come to life at like a third of the price tag.

So that’s a business model I’m tinkering with, and I’ve been doing that for the last like nine months. So I’m sure we’re on that, but it wasn’t always like this. Actually I was a, I was a wander, uh, for a long time. Hence the name wonder and wonder, right? Um, Man my story. I mean, we can, we can touch on that,

Dan: Yeah, let’s, let’s get into it. I think that’s a great, great starting point and tons. I want to dig into there, but, um, you know, uh, product and you focus on product and design. Has that always been your trajectory? Has that always been like, this is the direction I wanna go. And if not, where did that? When did that emerge?

Amar: Yeah. So I’ll just answer that really quick. Definitely not I I had no, no, uh, no idea that that was gonna be where I landed and I still don’t think it’s gonna be where I land for forever, but, uh, it’s a beautiful spot to see season to be in. I I’m a son of two immigrants. And my parents came from India.

They came from very little, uh, typical immigrant story. We moved around a ton and then we settled in Colorado. I grew up in a little bit of a rougher part of Lakewood, Colorado, and just not around like good things and good influences. And my parents took on two jobs. And so my younger brother and I just kind of like took care of each other and figured things out.

And our parents did everything they could to make sure our, our childhood was stable and not turbulent. So thankful for my parents of course, but, um, that definitely affected me. And so, you know, I always, I struggled with reading a ton and ESL on the, you know, don’t know English, like at home, like Gujarati was what we spoke and I’m like going to school and I’m like trying to understand what’s going on and, you know, I’m just trying to hack the system.

I tried to figure out like, what are ways I can just get through school? Cuz all I wanna do is go play PlayStation or something, you know? And I’m just getting made fun of and, and not knowing English very well. And so, you know, anyways, eventually overcame that went to middle school, did the middle school route, um, figured out there’s a gifted and talented program in our school.

Didn’t even know what gifted and talented meant. Somehow I snuck into that hallway and started talking to a few GT students just to understand, Hey, like tell me more about like, what is GT? And they’re like gifted and talented. And like we’re doing these things and here I’m so juxtapose this with like where I’m going back home is like an apartment.

And like my brother and I I’m sharing a bed, I don’t have my own room or anything like that. My mom’s, you know, struggling, sleeping in a closet. Um, cuz that’s just, we it’s a small apartment and. I’m in, I’m in a high school and middle school with like these kids who come to school, just like have really nice cars and like really nice homes and like my whole life, like I never let anyone come to my home or my apartment, cuz I was ashamed of just like how I grew up and how I was living.

And I’m realizing how important that, that story really is, you know, more and more. I talk to people,

Dan: it’s huge.

Amar: but I went into high school and I got there, and I did the IB program actually hustled my way into that as well and got into did that program. It’s like a step above advanced placement it’s and I don’t, you know, it definitely prepped me in a lot of ways for college and stuff, because it was just four hours of homework every night and just ridiculous.

Dan: Oh, man.

Amar: Ugh, man. So, so tough. But you know, I think. A big part of my story is in high school, I kind of got surrounded with, uh, I had really great friends, but I, you know, going back home and just being around a negative workplace, cuz I had a, you know, high school job that you always do. And I was working at a retail store at the time and just around bad influences.

And so I started drinking a ton, started doing drugs, um, and did that for just a really two, three years. And man, it, it really got me in dark place. Um, I was often. Numb trying to numb my reality, cuz again, just full of shame. Not nothing was nothing was going right at school for me. I, I, my economic socioeconomic status wasn’t, you know, changing.

And I, I had thought at that age, you know, middle school, high school that if I get the education, now that things will just change at it. It would some overnight success thing would happen or like something, someone was gonna come save me or whatnot. But at that age, I just didn’t know. Um,

and so fast forward in the college, um, I somehow made it there applied to university of Colorado, Boulder, like an hour before the deadline, cuz I didn’t want to go to college. I was a, I was ashamed of going to college cuz I. I didn’t think I had what it takes. And I also thought that my parents couldn’t afford it. I gave up violin. It was like the, one of the biggest things I loved when I was in sixth grade because we couldn’t afford it. And so in my mind, that kind of really scarred me and like so many opportunities I had to say no to.

And I wouldn’t even bring up with my parents or get creative on how to hustle, cuz I just gave up. I’m like, you know, when you’re in that scarcity mindset, you just go, ah, there’s, that’s not for me. and that’s the whole thing.

Now I’m working to like help young at risk youth. And like people realize it’s like, no, that is for you. And you can go knock on that door, but here’s how you go about that. Right. So many of us don’t know how to knock on the doors and ask for help in, in this world. So college crazy pre-med I have failed premed. I tried to do that cuz you know, my parents are like, Hey, like you should, you should like go like, you know, Do medicine.

And I had a few health problems growing up. So I was like, yeah, like that, that’s a good idea. That’s very redemptive. And I placed a lot of meaning in that. And I was like, yeah, that’s, that’s a path. Holy cow. I was wrong. it was so I don’t know why universities don’t tell you. Like, they people say like it’s hard, but.

Man. I was like, man, we’re not, we’re not actually applying any of this. We’re just doing these labs in like dark basement. And I, I didn’t spend how much money. Like my parents had invested to like me to go to college. I was like, this is ridiculous. Like I’m not gonna do chem lab. So I kind of wandered campus and talked to my. College council is like, Hey, like, I don’t really know, you know, that all that hard freshman, if any of those have gone to college freshman, sophomore year, you’re

Dan: Many of us have been there.

Amar: you start, you go like, Hey, like what other degrees can I get? Um, and I was like, uh, yeah, I, you know, I have an interest for technology, but I didn’t, again, in my mind technology that’s like nerdy to me, you know?

Well, I don’t know about.

Dan: yeah. What does that look

Amar: What does that look like? Exactly. And so I wandered the computer science department for a little while and I just saw how depressed, um, students were. Um, they were super stressed out working a ton. I said, man, something’s gotta change. Like. I just always felt in my heart that I had to be this person that could bring light.

Like, you know, God always put down my heart is like, Omar bring light wherever you roam. So, yep. I literally dropped, pre-med switched to computer science and did it. And the whole time I was really focused on like, Building social capital with people building rapport, but loving on them, you know, trying to be just positive in the classrooms.

I mean, you wanna talk about a program that was ridiculously hard. Holy cow. Um, that was, that was the computer science program. And I wasn’t like, I wasn’t wicked smart or gifted, you know, and I’m just trying to, you know, connect with these individuals and encourage them. And so that was the journey. Right.

And so that’s like the, the adolescent journey and, and there was, you know, how I got out of the drugs and alcohol. you know, a few times when I was working this job, a few like older truck drivers would come by and there’s this one story I’ll just quickly share. Um, a guy had smelled alcohol under my breath and just said, Hey son, this, this life isn’t for you.

You know? And so moments like that, like you wanna talk about divine, like you wanna talk about

divine, like, like definitely like that. And then in college I had a buddy that. Struggled with, um, he tried to get me off alcohol for a really long time. And one night he ended up, he was rushing a fraternity, um, fraternities aren’t inherently bad.

Uh, but he, you know, he had, he had gone off and, and done that. And one night he calls me, his mom called me he’s in the hospital and he’s just telling me, I was telling him, I was like, this is so unlike you, you know? And he had said like, Omar, honestly, it is so unlike me. Um, but I just wanted to be more like you.

Dan: Wow.

Amar: And that hit me, you know?

And it’s, I have so many different moments like that. Like, I can just point to so many of ’em where PE you don’t, we don’t realize, you know, what we post, what image we, what mask we wear, what we carry, how that affects people, what they aspire to become, you know? And. I, I didn’t realize I had that effect on people that they would almost take their, you know, put themselves in situations where they don’t have good self-control and they can end up in, in dark places cuz they’re just in pursuit of the facade.

Right. And, and, and how many of us go to work with the facade and it’s okay. Like naturally, you know, it’s, you can’t bring everyone into everything. And so. After college. I, I wandered for a little while and I took on this crazy internship, uh, super blessed a guy at church, I met his name’s John, and he had said, Hey, like, do you wanna.

You wanna work on this app? And I said, nah, I don’t know if I can right now, da, da, da two months later, he calls me again. I didn’t really know much about the app. And he said, it’s called sober grid. And the app helps people stay sober. It’s the largest network. Isn’t that crazy? Like, here I am like, I’d struggle with all this, like drugs, alcohol and all this stuff.

And like, he’s like first opportunity outta college. He’s like, Hey. You wanna work on app that like helps people stay sober. I’m like, dude, sign me up. Did that. Um, and we both ended up leaving that shortly after I went on to go do, uh, sourcing and diversity inclusion, uh, at Techstars for a little while, which was super

amazing. I got exposed to some of the best founders in the world and got to learn a ton, but I wasn’t proud of who I was becoming. You know, Dallas Willard says, it’s not about what you do. It’s about who you’re becoming in, in this life. And so one of the reasons why I wasn’t proud is, like, people I, I was, I helped with the pitch event.

Like they, we hosted like this little like local pitch event at text artists where people would come in, pitched ideas. And man, sometimes I would give feedback to people. I just feel like I crushed their dreams.

Dan: Oh,

Amar: Like I’m like, oh my gosh, like Omar, like if you, if you know, here I am, this guy trying to be the light, trying to be positive. And it was such a hard register to switch into, but when I was in VC land and mode, I was just very cutthroat, but like I had nothing to back it up, like I’m realize, like I was like, I have the, I have the brand, but I haven’t built my own company. I don’t, I haven’t gotten in the arena as Theodore Roosevelt says and gotten my face marred. I’ve done none of that.

Dan: yeah.

Amar: So here I am giving all this advice to people and crushing them. I was like, man, that’s, that’s not, that’s not who I am. So left a opportunity. There went onto another internship. This is two years outta college. I’m living on the, my, the floor of my brother’s, uh, dorm room on an air mattress.

I go to whole foods and I just ate one meal a day. Cause I was like, that’s the most matte nutrient, like the micronutrient meal I could get from the, like the buffet. And then. would just go and read about, uh, read through product and design magazines and watch magazines. I love watches at Barnes and noble and I would kill time and then go home and, and then wake up the morning after and just go to this internship.

And no one knew like, you know, no one knew that I was on the floor of my younger brother’s room and I on an air mattress, I’m living out of a, the tiniest luggage. I’m like even smaller than a carryon and I’m just living life. And I was, as hard as it was very cold. Um, I wasn’t homeless or anything, but you know, it was like I had a greater, I was so happy. I was fulfilled. I was like, I’m just, I’m making progress.

And so fast forward, I landed a few product gigs and I’ve done a few here and there. I’ve learned a ton along the way. I’ve worked on some apps you’ve probably used, uh, if you’re in the faith ecosystem and yeah, that’s, that’s basically it. I mean, there’s a, there’s a lot there, Dan, but that’s like the high level

Dan: I love it. Thank you for that high level overview. What, uh, what an incredible journey, um, yeah, that, that you’ve been on and I just, um, I mean, so many, so many moments just kinda stick out to me, but just picturing you in, in, in the, the halls of a, of a, you know, uh, computer science, you know, building, trying to, trying to, to spread, spread, you know, spread light and love, right?

Like it feels like, like that’s, in some ways it feels like that’s not, that’s not what, uh, people go to that, those programs for typically. And I, I like, I wonder how much, how much did you feel like that was your space? That was your people. Did, did you have that feeling like, or, or, and have you had that feeling in your, in your career?

Like this is it, this is, this is, these are my people, this is where I, this is where I belong.

Amar: Hm. I’s a really great question. I, I definitely did not think those were my people. I, I, I think there was just a part of me just growing up where anything nerdy, I just didn’t connect with. Like I wanted to be smart. Like I definitely wanted to do good, but. Computer science attracts this like certain demographic, nothing wrong, just wicked, smart, talented people.

And I just didn’t wanna be around that. I feel that I had a chip on my shoulder that I was just, you know, I could do it my own rogue way and you know, but I was so wrong. Uh, and it is so, so beautiful when you walk into a space open minded, right. And just go, you know what? Yeah. These might not be my people, but I’m gonna do my best to, to.

Right. Like to, there’s a book it’s called, uh, change your questions, change your life. It’s like the judge or

mindset versus the learner mindset and any space I walk into. I’m trying, even if I know I am a domain expert in this to some extent, quote unquote,

right? I go, there’s something I can learn. My glass is not, not full.

I don’t know everything. And so, as it relates to my career, I’ve, I’ve just gone off and I’ve realized, don’t always look for spaces, create the space, you know, like so many of us try to go and find these spaces and they exist. But sometimes if you’re like early on, you don’t know what you want. And also there’s coincidence.

There’s people who also don’t know what they want. And they’re all wandering and figuring things out. So if you build your own first community and you attract a tribe, right. And so, you know, you kind of come up with those like core values, those core things. And that’s kind of like what I’m trying to do with like wonder and wonder, like our product design is, is like, can we take, get all the, like goodhearted people in the world to like instantly get connected to opportunities for the underdogs and like fuel fulfilled, right?

It’s a, it’s a big moonshot idea. We’ll see. And it’s currently being done through an agency and we have to figure out the software side or whatever. but in terms of spaces and your question, right? It’s like, yeah. I, I, I think it’s always kind of, you’ve had to find that one person who can like, kind of be your buddy and like go with them to these spaces too.

So it, yeah, not, not, not originally. I was like, nah, computer science. I don’t know.

Dan: yeah, yeah. I love that. Well, I wanna talk about, um, like motivation and as you’re telling your story, it felt, it feels like, like you’ve had a lot to, to overcome. Right. And I’m picturing you, you know, on, on the floor of your brother’s, um, Dorm room and that phase doing that internship, and you described it like, like one of your happiest times in your life and I, as, as you were telling the story, it’s like, man, that sounds so depressing.

That sounds like, so that sounds so hard, but like, it, it shows like how much your mindset like shapes it. Right? Cause you could tell the story of like, oh, this is like a really, you know, you know, what, what, what was Omar? He doesn’t have a place, you know, he doesn’t have his own bedroom or whatever, but like at the same time, you’re like you live some of your best days.

And I’m just curious, like, how do you, how do you think about that? The joy that, that you had in that time and which I think ties to, like, how do you think about it now in your work today?

Amar: I think, I mean, this is not like an original idea, but practicing it is difficult, it’s reframing, I’m constantly challenging. Like how do I reframe this

like bad news into a good.

Dan: It’s so good. Yeah.

Amar: and it is so hard. I, you know, I to sit here and go like, oh yeah, I figured out the exact equation and the exact questions to ask and to journal and reflect upon and pray upon when you’re at bad news.

Like, no, my first reaction when of your bad news is usually. Mother or like cussing, you know, like a

Dan: Yes.

Amar: or something like God. Uh, but I re I’m trying to understand it’s, you know, when I’ve, doors have been closed, you know, I’ll give, I’ll go quick snippet. Like I had the opportunity to go, um, travel the world nine countries booked, ready to go.

Um, and COVID happened and you know that so many people, so many people in the world got experience, experience. and, uh, I went to church that night and, uh, the pastor had been on stage and he, I swear, he looked at in my area and he just said, you know, sometimes in life and I was so angry at God. And he said, sometimes at life, God closes doors and opportunities that he knows you don’t have the character to sustain you.

And like, that really hit me. I’m like, You’re telling me that the guy that’s been sleeping on the floor, taking a pay cut, uh, making so little donating most of his money or whatever it is trying to like, love on people still doesn’t have the character challenge accepted God. Like I was like, I was like, oh, oh, okay.

Dan: Game on.

Amar: yeah, let’s go. Let’s go. You know? And so I was sitting there and that was like, okay, let me just surrender the outcome. Let me keep surrendering. With everything. And so in my career specifically, too, right? Like I’ve been trying to understand, it’s like, okay, there’s things that happen every single day that are bad things.

I messed up in meetings. I’ve messed up in board meetings. I’ve messed up on big presentations. I’ve messed up with clients. I’ve all these things. These are mistakes, but the world’s moving so quickly that people don’t have time to remember your mistakes. They remember. And people also, I think, I don’t know if this is Steve jobs, don’t quote me, but he had said, “people don’t remember for what you said, they remember how you made them feel.”

Dan: Yeah.

Amar: And like, if you are just like constantly drowning in your negativity and all the mistakes you’ve made your, the mistakes you’ve made. Additionally, um, with, sorry. I’m I’m just trying to, sorry. I’m just trying to think through it.

Just like the mistakes you’ve made and then, um, your just, oh I’m not there yet mindset. Like, oh, I’m not there yet. I’m not there. You you, you failed to be present and you failed or go like, Hey wait, look at this amazing journey I’m on. And how, like how crazy, like my, I actually do carry a huge, um, Found like foundational piece to this, this great puzzle we call life. Like I am, I have purpose. I have meaning.

And, and also people don’t remember what ate two days ago for breakfast most of the time. So like, I promise you a month ago when you messed up in that one thing, they don’t even remember it. You know, like I always say like, when you make a mistake, just go make amends with people or like don’t let things fester when you engage in conflict, like, in the workplace too, like conflict is expected. Like don’t think joy and like positivity is like always the thing, like conflict is important and it allows us to get to a state that flow state of joy and optimism and positivity. But like anyone that’s telling you, like their workplace is just always positive and always optimistic. They’re hiding something. Cause that’s not true.

Dan: I love that. And I, I feel like, well, it’s so, so true. A couple things come to mind just about like, how people think about you, how much we worry about what, how people think about us and like, um, you know, there’s a quote, that’s like, you know, the, uh, like something about like the thing about like, worrying about , what people think about you is that they don’t. like, they’re just not thinking about you. Right? Like, but we beat ourselves up about, you know, saying this or that.

And another, I, uh, story just came to mind my own life of like, this is a tendency that I have, like what I feel like I, I, you know, said something or like, was like unkind to someone and like, I beat myself up about it. And then like sometimes months, sometimes even years later I’ll like, bring it up. I’m like, Hey, I just, this thing just eats me up that, like I said, this, or did this. And they’re like, this happened multiple times. Like I have no idea what you’re talking. But like, for me, it’s been like, in my mind, in my heart, like in my soul, like drawing, sucking energy out of me and like changing the way I think like, think about myself for, for months and years when really like, it was a non-issue and, uh, I just need to let myself go or probably talk about it with the person sooner and let my, let you know, so that they could, they could ha give me permission to let myself off the hook, you know?

Uh, so all that is, you know, to, to your point that. Negativity. It, it, it’s just not, not a good place to be.

Amar: And, and, you know, for, I know Dan has like a huge, huge, amazing, like audience with just tons of different, you know, everyone’s in different seasons of life.

Dan: Yeah.

Amar: Don’t be afraid to like, have grace on yourself.

Dan: Yeah.

Amar: love, love yourself, you know, forgive yourself if you can’t, if you can’t forgive yourself for the mistakes you’ve made. Um, you know, and if you’re religious, like God’s definitely forgiven you, but like also recognize like peop it’s gonna be harder for other people to forgive you. Like, you know, you carry that. So,

Dan: truth right


Amar: start with that. And it’s, it is hard. Like I’m just starting therapy and coaching. Like you wanna talk about a guy that’s like, You know, stoic and tried to like, be like, that’s not for me. Like, I’m, I’m better than that. No, I’m not. I actually need it. And I’m doing it. And it’s been, it’s been one of the best investments I’ve made, you know, to be able to talk about my internal world. Um, and then UN like get something tangible out of that and go, oh my gosh, that makes so much more sense. So anyways, if you’re thinking about therapy, that’s your sign right now to

Dan: That’s so good. I, I I’ll sign off on that one as well. It’s just so helpful to have someone else. To include someone else in that process, like, and to, to, to have someone who can, you know, lovingly call, call you out or call you to more or to re help you reframe because you’re so, so subconscious, like it just happens. It’s like you can’t see the forest for the trees cuz you’re in it, it’s your brain. The thoughts are always happening and, and you don’t have another brain to think about what’s going on in your brain, you know? Um, And so, yeah, just really a, a big, big fan of, of coaching and, um, and yeah, and counseling is great that you’re, you’re doing that.

I wanna talk a little bit about, um, about product. I don’t think I’ve had anyone in product. Uh, I mean, like I’ve had, I’ve had some, some engineers, um, developers on, on the show, but no one who’s like as passionate about product, um, As you, I know that, you know, I think you’re just passionate about life, right.

In a lot of ways. And so then I interpret that as like, Omar’s so passionate about product. Um, but maybe just to start, like when we’re talking about product, what, what, what do we talk about when we talk about product

Amar: Yeah. So a lot of things come to mind and, um, I think for me, it’s really, my goal is often like with product now, uh, is, is trying to create like products that like create habit formation and that are unto life changing. You know, life changing results. So, you know, I really try to design things that are delightful, right? With my team and work on things that like tr transcend just the screen or whatever you’re doing.

Like, you actually can take that experience and like try to replicate it in the real world. And that sounds very, you know, ethereal and like, what the heck like this guys just pulling stuff in the clouds. You know, a lot of people have gone off to, to do that. I mean, a really good example is kind of gum road.

Uh, for example, you know, if anyone has followed that, uh, so he’ll start that after he left Pinterest at 14 and lost all his op stock options, but he, he. He probably, he regrets that all the time, but Sahi started at gum road and it’s all about like creators, just being able to like sell their, any creation right away.

Like, I love that website. You can literally like make a notion template and then anyone can hit, I want this and they can choose how much they wanna pay for it. And then you can set pricing as well. But like that really sparked something in my entrepreneurial journey. So that’s why I bring that up. Holy cow.

I I’m a, I’m an E F J so I like things that are like kind of organized. And so like, I naturally create the create, try to create systems, but I’m like, I could productize this. I can sell

Dan: Yeah, yeah,

Amar: never, I never actually did that. But what I realized was that if, if anyone can sell stuff on gum road, like I can sell just my ability to like speak and inspire and love on people.

But also. I could sell my, the way I think about products to product manager, roles and product companies. And I did that. I, I worked, you know, I did, I did like scrum master product for a little while. And then right after that, I jumped to another place for short term. And that was a huge, huge opportunity and super fun.

Um, won’t share too much on that right now, but as it relates to product, it’s like, yeah, just creating the delightful experience, like habit formation to like create really good life changing habits. That’s like a right away is like what I go to.

Dan: I love it. That’s fantastic. That’s that’s, that’s helpful. Helpful for folks. When you think about like where you. In your well, and maybe, maybe the question is, how do you think about where you are in your career right now? How do you think about where. You know, cuz you’re, you’re, you’re early.

Right. And you don’t know, you don’t know where you’re going. And I do think like you have an advantage over a lot of folks that you like rapid iteration is a part of your work. And so I assume that you’re thinking about your career in an iterative manner that like you’re gonna be getting feed feedback and learning more about yourself in every step of the way.

But at, at 25, what do you think? Like when you look forward at the next 10, 15, 20 years of your career, What, what do you know? What, what do you know? What do you hope? Like what does that map look like?

Amar: Yeah, that’s a really great question. Um, Hmm. One of the big things I think for me in the next 10 years is I wanna really become a thought leader in my specific like demographic. So like the Indian product, uh, Area. And there’s a lot of already like amazing people in that, but also that I’ve kind of like the sons of immigrants, that’s a big layer to it, but that struggle with like drugs and alcohol, they didn’t believe in themselves.

So that lens, so, you know, maybe south Asians that I’ve struggled, um, with addiction that are now looking to like land their first career, I really wanna be like known in that space as like, you gotta unlock tomorrow. That guy, it. And again, I wasn’t like so many, the big, the big secret. So you don’t have to wait 10 years to hear this.

Right. It’s it was all done through other people helping me, like having the better, the courage to call me out on my crap. And like that accountability was like, what got me out of where I was at. Right. and to, to claim that I did it all by myself would be the biggest lie. So, so spend 10 years thought leader where, and the big thing is I’m trying to create community centers where at risk youth and just even people.

I, I don’t, I, you know, at risk youth is a big blanket statement. I think maybe just let’s even go bigger blanket statement. And just like people, anyone that feels like they’re an orphan or like a misfit, I wanna create these community centers where you can go in, you can get connected to someone right away.

And like, things like this already exists, but I wanna try to do it in a really unique way. Right away. When you have an idea, we can get you connected to someone to go start executing on that idea because inspiration is perishable. You know, so many people, they wander in a spaces, not knowing how to start, but if they’re just connected to one person, that’s a domino effect, right?

It’s like, you’re like, whoa, this person’s already had 10 years of experience. Like so much struggle. They could just give you a shortcut. So I wanna build the community centers in the next 10 years. And then in the 15 years, I think I wanna just help other people build generational wealth. I know that’s like a big thing that a lot of other people are already doing, but if I can like, kind of teach people who don’t believe in themselves again, that’s the theme, right?

You don’t believe in yourself, like teach you just practical things. Like, okay. Yeah. Financial, uh, wellbeing is one thing and there’s so many people already doing that. You don’t need me, but building the generational well, teaching you how to do that in a reproducible.

Dan: Yeah,

Amar: is something I wanna do. So that’s like the 10 to 15 year, like kind of big thing.

And then outside of business, I just wanna go to the wilderness. Like, I feel like God does so much great things and I wanna just take, um, friends and people on these, just trips in the wilderness to go backpacking and like, just disconnect. Like our computers are phones are devices are just like a matrix and I think God does powerful.

To a man’s in a woman’s heart in the wild. And so I wanna do that

Dan: I love

that. That’s a

Amar: some kind of like side thing. Yeah.

Dan: Yeah, it’s super, it is super fun. It’s really inspiring. I’m curious for people listening, who, I mean, a lot of people couldn’t play on this cuz they’re looking for some, some sort of change, whether that be like major change, like they wanna change their job, their, their career or smaller change.

Like they just need to change their mindset. But a lot of times they feel kind of stuck in some ways. And I’m curious if you have any words of encouragement that you would offer to people that are in a stuck kind of space at this moment while they’re listen.

Amar: I love that question. it’s it gets me giddy. Like it’s by the one that is like, cuz I’m stuck every day.

Dan: Yeah, right. We all, we all get

stuck. That’s a great place to start. That’s a great place to start for everyone listening. We all get stuck.

Amar: I like to ask myself. Kind of this look at like an audit. And I know it sounds boring to some people, but it’s, it’s been helping me. So maybe this is, you know, you try it. I look at like my family and friends relationships wise. I look at myself financially. I look at my like net worth or whatever. And then I look at myself professionally and I look at my heart.

That’s a big one. Don’t don’t forget that. In fact, you can, you can get rid of your finances and the professionally and focus on your family and your heart. And that will get you farther than those two things that I called out like, uh, will ever will. But I do an audit and I look at my, look at, look at it where I kind I’ve started doing this every Sunday.

I look at the week prior and I look at, I kind of give myself a score from one to 10, like how did I do on those areas? Right. But then. I do it once a month or, you know, when I get that stuck, irritated feeling, I do the thing that self-love, I, I do the thing that allows me to just pampered, you know, for men listening, maybe that’s like a word you’re like, I don’t resonate with that, but like go do something that allows you to

Dan: take care of yourself.

Amar: care of yourself. Maybe that’s a, I always do this when I get stuck. Sometimes I wear like a suit. So I’m wearing one today, just kind of a little stressed out, but like kind of helps your image. Or if you’re, you know, you’re a girl put on a dress that like makes you feel, uh, delightful and beautiful, whatever it is and, and rock that, cuz look good, feel good.

That’s one thing. And I changed my mind. That’s already changed my mind. Sometimes I get a haircut if I need to, you know, like you just change it up, change it up. I work out of a different place. I’ve never been to like a new coffee shop, a new cafe. So.

Dan: Love that.

Amar: I look back at the last three months and I, or even a year or two years.

And I don’t forget how, how far I’ve come and those listening right now, don’t forget how far you’ve come. Don’t forget that every single time you’re listening to one of these episodes, like you are working on yourself, it’s that, you know, 40 minutes to an hour, you’re putting aside to listen to Dan’s podcast.

It’s an investment in yourself. And so that all these things that, that big question is like, how far have I come? When I feel stuck? That’s like kind of the first question. How far have I come? So yeah.

Dan: perfect. What a great, yeah. What a great question. Thank you for that, Omar. And I think it’s, again, just helps, helps us, helps you to reframe that stuckness, right. That it’s not terminal that like you, you haven’t always been there and thus you’re not always going to be there, which is just really, really helpful.

I love that so much.

Amar: yeah. And I just, well, I’ll just say one thing to that, Dan, cuz you just sparked it. I think Steve Harvey said this. I love Steve Harvey. If you

guys don’t know who Steve Harvey is, go watch Steve Harvey. He said all your best day or all your worst days are already behind you. Like you’ve already made it through some of your worst days.

You wouldn’t

be here. If you haven’t made it through some of your I’m like what? The, that was awesome. So anyways, Dan, sorry,


Dan: goosebumps. I got goosebumps right there. He’s got some Steve Harvey

Amar: I

Dan: go goosebumps, which is so great. Amar. Thank you so much. This has been so fun. It’s always so fun to connect for folks that wanna follow along with your work.

Is there anything you’d like to invite people to.

Amar: Yeah. If you know, if you have a underdog, you know, mission driven organization that you wanna, like, you know, design a, you have an, you always wanna tinker with an idea or a product or a design. Um, my team can do it so you can visit [email protected]. And then for anyone that’s just wanna like on a Mort.

Personal level, um, on Instagram you can just reach out at where is Amar that’s? Uh, my name spelled a M a R and then it’s just, where is Amar? Cuz I’m always asking myself, where am I in my journey? Right. Um, but you can just follow me there, shoot me a DM and I’m happy to hop on, uh, call with you or connect on anything.

So yeah.

Dan: I love it. Thank you so much, Mar I’ll make sure to link up to those in the show notes for everyone. Um, who’s, who’s listening. Thanks so much for coming along and, uh, look forward to, uh, catching up on our next chat.

Amar: Thank you, brother blessings, everyone. Bye

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